LiveCode Forums.

Sorry but just a simple question. I have used a number of RAD environments in the past, loved working with HyperCard, and would like to get back into it. Do you see Runtime Revolution as having the "legs" to stick it out and remain a viable development platform for years to come? Loaded question but thought I'd ask the group.

Revolution has been around for ten years and the predecessor Metacard was first released back in 1992. So, combined with the imminent release of Rev 4.0, I woulod say they're growing strong.
The sad reality is that you can never be fully sure that your platform will still exist 5 years from now. Microsoft bought FoxPro back in the nineties, and last year annoçunced that they were no longer going to update it.
You could say that the only safe platform is where you stick with a language like C++ and be content there will always be a compiler - but then it will take you much longer to develop a good-looking application with the same functionality.
Of course there's a difference between a tool that is just a by-product of a large corporation, and the tool whose development is the main focus of a dedicated company.
So, just remind yourself 'nothing is forever' and hop on board - write the applications you want to write. And maybe in 10 years you'll have to rewrite everything - but hey, then you can use the latest and greatest tools of the time

Jan Schenkel.

loved working with HyperCard, and would like to get back into it

You will surely love Revolution too. If you are looking for a platform to develop apps on yourself I don't think that it matters that Revolution is a minority IDE and language. What matters is can you use it to produce what you want either for yourself or for other users. If you already know HyperCard you will find Revolution very easy and will have applications running in no time.

If you want a platform where you can get others to do the work for you then the decision is more difficult. If you go to any of the Freelancer sites and look for projects using Revolution or any other X-Talk language you wont find any. For web scripting languages you will find it hard to find a freelancer to do a RunRev CGI project but hundreds will help you with PHP, Perl, Javascript etc.

Of course that could be an opportunity.

Cheers

Phil

"If you want a platform where you can get others to do the work for you then the decision is more difficult. If you go to any of the Freelancer sites and look for projects using Revolution or any other X-Talk language you wont find any. For web scripting languages you will find it hard to find a freelancer to do a RunRev CGI project"

There are Rev developers out here.

I have a few projects, applications, and even a Rev CGI system that I can point potential clients to.

I would be happy to provide anyone with a quote.

sims@ezpzapps.com

I appreciate those who weighed in. This really helped me make my decision and I will purchase Run Rev. I have worked in a number of platforms that, as you said, came and went (including HyperCard) but none really were as productive for me as HyperCard (with a bunch of cool add-ons) was. In fact, I actually invested in SuperCard when they said they were "about to release" their Windows version since I think cross-compatibility is important. That being said, this never got out to the market and the company folded. After that, and since my new job didn't give me the time to code nifty solutions, I strayed away.

Thanks again for the feedback and I look forward to interacting with you all in the forum as I work my way through my newbie learning pains

Jan summed it up nicely. The only thing I could hope to add to that is to reinforce his observation about FoxPro, and how that relates to other products like HC and Rev.

HyperCard was owned by a rather sizable company, as was Gain Momentum (a Unix-based xTalk back in the '90s) which was owned by Sybase. Same with Oracle Media Objects, which was available for Mac and Win in the early '90s.

Apple, Sybase, and Oracle have so many things going on that they can afford to drop products like their xTalk offerings without blinking. And after just a few years, they did.

RunRev Ltd. has only two products, Rev and Ten Thumbs Typing Tutor which is made with Rev, so they're fully committed to seeing it through. They have no choice, and personally I like that. Bigger companies can afford to be fickle, but RunRev Ltd. is fully focused on expanding the Rev technology and its user base.

As with any sole-source proprietary development system, it takes a long time to get traction, certainly longer than most open source systems. If Flash hadn't been acquired by Adobe who knows if it would be as popular as it is today, but it seems unlikely. With fewer marketing resources than Adobe's multi-million-dollar budget, RunRev Ltd. has to take a more patient path.

But that path has been delivering reliable, solid growth year over year since they first started selling Rev back around 2001. With v4 offering a free RevMedia for development, a free RevWeb plugin for deployment, and soon a nifty new free server component, the options for growth are multiplying.

As with any company, there's no absolute guarantee that RunRev Ltd. will be running in perpetuity. We could all be hit by an asteroid tomorrow. But there are enough developers and their clients building businesses around the Rev technology that the larger Rev ecosystem has plenty of money floating around to keep the code base moving forward for a long time.

I occupy a very small corner of the Rev ecosystem, yet just among my own products and those of my clients we collectively have tens of thousands of users with combined revenues well into the millions. Multiply that by the number of developers making other commercial products with Rev, and the scope of the Rev ecosystem becomes clear.

Additionally, RunRev has noted Mike Markkula, former Apple chairman, among their many investors. Between good funding and guidance from people experienced in this sort of technology, and the growth opportunities for the many free Rev 4 products, I'm pretty confident about the state of things for the foreseeable future.

Wow, I really appreciate this insight. I agree with you regarding Flash. There's a funny story there actually. I was attending a MacWorld Conference when I strolled over to an area with small booths dedicated mostly to products aimed at teachers. There was a very small booth from a small company in San Diego selling "Splash." Splash was a nifty drawing program for teachers that let them create results that look "painted" rather than illustrated with a program like Illustrator. I'm an artist so I fell in love with the notion of using an eraser (or rubber for our overseas friends) to edit vector graphics. I bought the program immediately and was in conversations with this small family outfit to produce some learning guides and tutorials for their product.

Next, they sent me something they thought I'd like to review... Splash Animator! Basically, Splash with the ability to do animations. Again, I was excited, we talked about tutorials and teaching aids, but they said they had to put things on hold a bit since there was something in the works. That "something" was Macromedia buying Splash and immediately repackaging it as Macromedia "Flash." In fact, Flash used to run .spl files. I'm wondering if it still will

I remember that MacWorld. The Flash booth still had some items there with the old brand on them.

Some xTalk trivia: one of the founders of FutureWave was Charlie Jackson, whose former company Silicon Beach Software brought Bill Appleton's SuperCard to the market.

Small world.