Is LiveCode really Live?

[steven.pribilinskiyBUSI3SL]

Recently I've come across LightTable, an Interactive Cross-platform IDE - and it is really LIVE! However currently it will support only Javascript, Clojure and Python.
http://www.kodowa.com/
It started as a KickStarter Project: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/ibdknox/light-table, you can download and try it at http://app.kodowa.com/playground

RunRev LiveCode doesn't evaluate the code while writing the code. We can type anything in the editor and there'll be a "No errors occured" statement in the Errors tab.
We still have to debug-run to test the code by pressing the "Apply" button.
The "Run(browse) tool" is similar to the Debug/Run command in other IDEs with the only difference is that there's no delay.

If LiveCode IDE could evaluate while typing (as LightTable does), the company name would be DevRev instead of RunRev

Currently the LiveCode debugger even can't catch infinite loops. Following three lines of code will hung the IDE:

Code: Select all

   local a = 1
   repeat while a = 1
   end repeat

after running the above code it is not possible to Stop the execution. Without enabling revSmartSave the work will be lost.

I wish Runtime Revolution will become sometime Development Revolution and the IDE will consist from Docked panels

Can someone explain this statement "Make iterative, agile changes in real time".
I have to perform 1-3 steps before the code will be evaluated.
1. Apply in the Code Editor
2. Choose the Run Tool if it isn't selected
3. Click/Press something to test.

Am I missing something?
Is it possible to start some game/app loop and while it is running, modify the code and see result immediately after clicking Apply?
That's poosible with LightTable even without clicking the Apply button

[Bernard]

after running the above code it is not possible to Stop the execution.

I know little about LightTable. However, on the assumption that it is a REPL environment (e.g. like working at a python interpreter's prompt), how would you stop such an endless loop in Python/LightTable?

[steven.pribilinskiyBUSI3SL]

I didn't tried yet, but writing code without refreshing the screen Is a Truly Live Code experience

[Mark]

Hi,

It is not true that the LiveCode IDE can't cope with infinite loops. Press command-period (OSX) or control period (Win) and the script is aborted, provided that no further errors occur. The only problem with the IDE is that the debugger is quite buggy and may invoke errors itself, which sometimes trigger the debugger again and hence cause another infinite loop.

"Make iterative, agile changes in real time" is marketing speech. I don't care about marketing speech when I decide whether or not to buy a new version of LiveCode. I only care about testing and seeing if it works as I want it to work.

Kind regards,

Mark

[Dixie]

That's poosible with LightTable even without clicking the Apply button

If that would make you happy, then, use LightTable

Dixie

[Bernard]

I didn't tried yet, but writing code without refreshing the screen Is a Truly Live Code experience

It is possible for you to play with this yourself, if that is what you wish to do.

Create a field, and set a handler on that field to respond to a key press (e.g. the "enter" key being pressed). In that handler you would simply tell LiveCode to "do" what was in that field.

http://docs.runrev.com/Command/do

Even in the old days of SmallTalk, one had to tell the Smalltalk IDE to evaluate a piece of code ("do it", I believe in the Squeak IDE). And historically there are not many environments more dynamic than Smalltalk.

Much of what LiveCode is, is modelled on what a traditional IDE should be like; LightTable is trying to re-invent the IDE. So I think it is a bit much to expect LiveCode (which is built on 20 year old technology) to be able to match the features of the latest-and-greatest vapourware conjured up by hackers in Lisp, which they are designing to be an almost unique environment, an enviornment aimed at elite hackers, not one aimed at us normal people. If you wanted LightTable to produce apps that would run on Windows, iPhone, and Android, I think you'd be disappointed.

LiveCode is certainly at the most dynamic end of the spectrum (up there with Smalltalk, Javascript, etc., it's just not object-oriented). LiveCode doesn't have the debug+invent aspect of Smalltalk, where new code can be written at breakpoints and evaluated based on the state of variables (in the past we certainly could write code in the MessageBox when execution was stopped at a breakpoint, but I think this was removed at some point).

[steven.pribilinskiyBUSI3SL]

Ctrl+period - aborts the script, thanks for the tip, Mark.
Currently I have a lack of experience, will explore LiveCode documentation thoroughly before making any further statements.

Dixie, LightTable supports only Javascript, Clojure and Python - you can't deploy dektop applications with them.
The idea to present LightTable here is to discuss whether LiveCode deserves it's Name.
Marketing is crucial to hook the newcomers
Thanks Bernard for your clearance.